Pfsense dlna across subnets. dlna would be fine if your on 1 flat network.
Pfsense dlna across subnets. Never try to interact blindly with your system, use always the capture data to understand, what is wrong with your current config and where to go further! Oct 10, 2020 · Hi, I am setting up pfSense and other equipment at home behind my existing router before I deploy it. Jun 22, 2023 · We widely use Open Source and especially PFSense. Oct 30, 2018 · pfSense version 2. 1 (pfsense) LAN - 192. With the networks set up you can play around with the firewall of pfsense to manage the subnets access to other subnets and the wan etc Sorry for spelling Jul 1, 2023 · These types of devices often use a flavor of multicast DNS (mDNS) to "find" other devices on a network to share their streaming data. I understand how to configure the firewall to permit unicast packets through, but how do I I have set up pfSense with two NIC's as router for my home. IF you were able to get AirLink to work going between subnets, how did you do it? I must be missing something. If what your using requires dlna - I would pick a different product. So it allows devices behind it to open firewall rules and setup port forwards like the xbox is doing. My configuration is as below. It's commonly used as a way to bridge distant networks. Your network map let me assume it is. My Plex server is on the 192. The LAN IP address on the firewall becomes the default gateway for hosts on the LAN. The default TTL is 1 if the field is left blank. 5 net no matter what i do. It's kind of the opposite of . com/r/PFSENSE/comments/bcqcsb/dlna_clients_to_dlna_media_server_across_subnets/) . I have created a firewall Traffic Rule to allow access between subnets 3 and 4, and tried it. Mar 25, 2017 · The pfsense router needs a static route to all subnets beyond the L3 router to function correctly. But I have a problem with devices in different VLANs/subnets using DLNA. You could try ‘UDPbroadcastrelay’ app or pimd on a pi. If your Home Assistant server resides in a different VLAN than your Xiaomi device, this guide will help you set up NAT and firewall rules on a PFSense firewall to enable communication securely. May 27, 2010 · I am trying to connect a device cable of connecting to a DLNA server on one subnet of my network to a DLNA server (MediaTomb) on a different subnet of my network - connected via a Linksys RVL200. DLNA across two networks. I've seen a solution for unifi secure gateway, but can't get this to work with pfsense. 1/24) while mobile devices connected via WLAN to VLAN 20 (192. Merging subnets is not an option . 255. Bart Need some help, I have opnsense firewall and currently have my network segregated into different subnets. I am wondering if there is a way for the device on the smart network can see the SMB shares on the main network, and further if I could limit this visibility to only the Dune box and not all devices. Things start to break down though if the Chromecast devices and the clients that would like to cast to them (phones, PCs, etc. 3-RELEASE-p1 NAS - 192. I have recently introduced a pfsense router and firwall into my network and have created two sub domains. At a very high level, these DLNA/mDNS devices use multicast instead of unicast to communicate. I agree with the last one. 0/24 ; Untagged; Interface LAN. windows network). 0/24 subnet for trusted wired clients VLAN 20 (orange) for the 192 Oct 31, 2018 · Hi, I have two VLANs, VLAN1 and VLAN2 each on their own subnet, with a pfSense firewall at the hub. I found this guide: bonjour across VLANs but I a Feb 22, 2025 · I have several vlans here and I've tried to get DLNA to work within different subnets using IGMP Proxy and PIMD. I was told to file a bug report here after posting on the forums first, and am happy to help with gathering more data if needed. Luckily many routers have a built in mDNS repeater built in or as a add on, in this article we will be Jul 30, 2023 · I have moved all IoT devices to a separate vlan. 2 and 192. While you will need to open your firewall from the DLNA client to the DLNA server on whatever port DLNA content is being served from, that is insufficient to get the whole protocol to work across vlans. You will be taken to the Ipsec configuration wizard in Pfsense. reddit. Normally ARP tells your computer what MAC address belongs to which IP, so they can talk to each other. Sep 3, 2025 · Using IPsec with Multiple Subnets pfSense® software handles multiple IPsec networks using separate IPsec phase 2 entries which define source and destination pairs to pass through a tunnel. The VLAN interfaces are Mar 23, 2010 · Behind my pfSense i have many subnet (vlans) and the problem is that i am not able to get into the internet, when I am in a different subnet than the pfSense is. Feb 27, 2023 · 'Casting' to a Chromecast work great (well, it works OK) in a single network, but can be a bit daunting to configure across different networks. Jul 15, 2022 · There are many ways to make this work (with mixed results), your simplest option is to move the NAS to the subnet of the TVs or add a second NIC and put it on 2 subnets. Re-adopt all devices in IoT vlan using iphone connect to IoT wifi. Nov 17, 2023 · It is recommended to subnet your network and isolate devices based on type or use (Home, Office, IoT, Guest) and many new routers can do this out of the box. mDNS and similar multicast protocols do NOT work across different IP subnets without some type of proxy to rebroadcast the multicast traffic from one subnet to another. The following example shows how to configure two VLANs, ID 10 and 20, with igb2 as the parent interface. I am pretty familiar with all the major media server software, plex, emby, jellyfin. Setup: Server on LAN TV on WLAN IMGP Proxy setup: Interface: LAN Type: Upstream Interface Network address: (LAN IP) X. 4. 1. rinse and repeat until you unbreak the connection. Are there any guides to help me set this up? Dec 2, 2024 · Xiaomi Miio devices, such as air purifiers, often fail to communicate across subnets or VLANs due to restrictions in their UDP packet handling. The DLNA server and the Data server are on different physical interfaces and on different VLANs. 10. I see this as a very needed functionality if it’s not already capable. DLNA relies on the SSDP protocol to operate. For hosts connecting by an interface other than LAN, use the appropriate configuration for the interface to which the device is Aug 10, 2016 · Dude if you want different networks then connect them to pfsense. Additionally, some devices, even with a default gateway specified, do not use that gateway. 3 Hi, I have two VLANs, VLAN1 and VLAN2 each on their own subnet. Within pfsense you can set up multiple interfaces which refer to the vlan id's you specified before. For now I have control through Homebridge. You could then do a normal routed tunnel with OpenVPN. Looking at the pfSense logs, I can see the Quest 2 connecting to internet addresses but no local addresses. through all my fav. mobile devices) to communicate with consumer media players in another subnet, including Google casting (eg YouTube to Smart TV). But having trawled the inet,. I have tried to get the DLNA/UPNP/Etc… protocols to be visible across subnets for hours now. UDP 1900 Feb 15, 2019 · However, in the pfsense top menu, there is a Diagnostics -> Packet tracer, and there you can really trace everything. 44), because DLNA resolving is performed via broadcasting (port 1900) and broadcast packets do not get to the VPN interface. 2 net to my . 0/24 with logging enabled. Never was - just access shares via their fqdn. Login to pfsense VPN-> IPsec Click on Add P1 to add Ipsec phase1 parameters. Windows network browser has never worked across vlans. DLNA is the same (https://www. And causing you grief in what you want to do. Apart from the fact that I did not manage and I could not find any recent success story on internet or in the forum. 1 (psfense) I Sep 29, 2023 · SSDP/DLNA across different subnetsI'd move the firewall rule to the network the casting device is on and create a pass rule from the casting device IP, to the Network you want it to go to. resources,. I have a Roku in one VLAN, and an Emby server in another. Jul 12, 2021 · Has anyone been able to get a HDHomerun discovery working between 2 different subnets using this UDP Broadcast Relay? I've been playing with UDP Broadcast relay, mDNS repeater, and IGMP proxy and haven't had any luck. (also assuming that the firewall on pfsense has been disabled and we are talking about a purely routing issue still). And here things get tricky: I can ping between subnets, but attempts at a TCP connect from a host on subnet A to a target on subnet B will time out. Default GW 192. 20. On the LAN side is a DLNA Server (Twonky) and some DLNA clients / media renderer. 0/24 to VPN. The setup in this subnet is simple Unraid -> docker -> MiniDLNA and Gerbera -> Unmanaged switch -> pfsense | -> wifi router in access point mode, dhcp disabled -> android phone Nov 29, 2022 · @bob-dig said in Multicast traffic between LAN interfaces on different subnets: I think you should solve it by putting all the devices in the same subnet. I've done exactly this to allow my SkyQ boxes (UK TV) to be discoverable on my main VLAN (they are on their own VLAN). Inter-domain routing is enabled across VLAN 1 and … May 1, 2020 · The problem I recently bought a router that supports VLANs, so I have segregated my network using VLANs and firewall rules to allow home assistant to communicate with all devices freely, but device I am also aware of Plex doesn't require DLNA. Back from windows 3. mini-DLNA uses two ports: TCP 8200: I… This all runs on a virtual host pfsense on vmware esxi, backed by unifi switch and APs. Each VLAN is assigned to an interface, enabled, has DHCP enabled, and an ip range set like 10. It seems you cannot merely route UDP Broadcasts and indeed why would you - you need an active Daemon similar to Cisco's IP Helper to catch packets and drop in out into the other subnet. I'm trying to make the ReadyNAS drive appear in my shared devices on my Mac and available on Popcorn hour media player when located on different sub net. Jul 18, 2017 · If anyone has gotten Spotify Connect to wrok with sonos across vlans it would be great to know how you did it. 251 Things work --- BUT there seems to be a catch The computer casts great But the iphone when casting picture (Google photos) -- sometimes it takes forever for image to be displayed -- but when the first is displayed, the subsequent May 4, 2023 · PfSense forwards traffic to the server IFF the inbound packet comes from a member of the Alias. I divide my network into subnets by purpose, with 10. ) using mDNS just fine across different vLANs/Subnets. dlna was never meant to work across subnets. X subnet. I am struggling to proxy / relay some of… Feb 20, 2025 · Anyway, I don't know HD Homerun, but according Wikipedia it uses DLNA. I've searched around a bit but haven't found a conclusive answer to my question, so I come here to see what everyone here has to say. 100. Additionally, I have semi-untrusted devices on Media and so I have firewall rules preventing traffic between the two. Jul 9, 2017 · DLNA on two subnetsI suspect that the issue is with multicast. PMS broadcasts to 239. not even utube has a video talking about how to setup PIMD etc,. x used for media. This sometimes doesn't work for IOT devices. Jul 15, 2022 · Moving DLNA server to same vlan as consuming devices is the simple fix. Nov 4, 2014 · How would one install or configure pfsense if you have multiple subnets connected to a router, and that router connects to pfsense? For example, if you have It looks like it relies on UPnP/DLNA which won't work across subnets, for auto discovery at least: You can also try to manually enter the IP address of the Marantz unit in the app and try to connect then to the unit. I would like to be able to access files on the NAS over DLNA from Media. But may be fine for your application. 30. Click Add Network to enter additional networks. Unfortunitly do to the nature of mDNS you cannot simply simply add a Routing rule to allow the traffic across the VLAN it must be relayed via a Repeater in order to traverse VLANs. If this works, your network configuration may block some UPnP ports necessary for browsing through media servers, detecting units Jul 20, 2016 · Essentially, I am trying to emulate two subnets with clients connecting to their own pfSense, each pfSense then connecting to pfSense 1 which acts as the internet gateway. I'd like to access music on my NAS box DLNA service (subnet 3), from my TV and media players (subnet 4). This short reference explains what is needed. In Infra, I have a NAS. 0. Sep 11, 2018 · Hi Guys I though I should share with you a working configuration with DLNA across VLAN's. Proxy ARP fakes the destination MAC, giving the proxy/router the ability to forward the traffic to another network. DLNA, by spec, is limited to the subnet. most unusual,. 3. You can then allow upnp on any network you have. Avahi/mdns is configure to broadcast across subnets. Steve Jul 6, 2022 · Threshold: The TTL threshold for forwarded data on an interface, to prevent looping from occurring. May 27, 2018 · I have a Marantz with Spotify connect on it connected via LAN to VLAN 30 (192. But you have already set that rules as your screenshot shows. My intend is to implement "dumb L2 discovery protocol" across subnets in my home network because it's my home, I want things to be easy, dumb proof and willing to forgo some security & performance because it's just my home network. What I'm struggling with is how to route broadcast traffic from 192. Otherwise you would need Nov 1, 2024 · Hey there, I am interested in using a docker on my unraid server to deploy a Bonjour gateway/reflector. This doesn't work well with access points though as you usually want them to broadcast more than one Aug 4, 2021 · In a throwback to the problems I dealt with using AirPlay across VLANs, I recently jumped through similar hoops for Sonos speakers. if you need stuff like mdns or multicast between segments then you could ahavi or igmp proxy, etc. 1), but can't ping my PCs on HOME VLAN. 168. For you to see stuff on different vlans in windows network browser you would need to run wins server. The DLNA server runs in an LXC. If you need a switch for that and maybe a wireless access point, both with vlan support, then get those. TVs are fine with that as they get the DLNA brodcasting on the same subnet However, I wanted to receive the DLNA stream on another VLAN. May 6, 2020 · After much trial-and-error, I've managed to configure pfsense to allow hosts in one subnet (e. May 27, 2019 · A place to discuss Netgate products and projects such as pfSense, TNSR, and hardware I have the "Repeat mdns packets across subnets" option in Avahi enabled too. Aug 17, 2023 · Sometimes the wap guest network settings isolate all devices. Networks: A list of CIDR-masked Network entries to control what subnets are allowed to have their multicast data proxied. 250 from the roku through my OPNSense firewall, to the Emby server, the Emby server will discover the Roku and add it automagically. But do you know what a VLAN actually is, and what the difference is between a VLAN and a Subnet? Today I’m going to cover the numbering of subnets in your network, and how to set up new subnet and VLAN interfaces in OPNsense. However, a switch cannot filter anything normally, but pfSense can, even on Nov 19, 2020 · UDP Relay The next step is to setup a UDP Relay that can repeat mDNS trafic across subnets. . However, I would also like the pfSense to route traffic between the two subnets. in my case to support dlna traffic across subnets. 2 Spice ups show post in topic Topic Replies Views Activity DLNA Across VLANS Networking discussion , cisco 8 206 June 28, 2015 file server shares over multiple subnets - best practices Networking discussion , general-networking 1 103 March 30, 2015 Multicast Dec 8, 2020 · I'm having trouble getting Direct Play/Stream across VLANs. 168 May 23, 2019 · pfSense 2. I use a Synology NAS with a media server (IOT VLAN) while my devices are on LAN. 0/24 subnet for trusted WiFi clients VLAN 25 (blue) for the 192. Console VLAN configuration VLANs can be configured at the console using the Assign Interfaces function. X subnet and I'd like to add some Plex client devices that are on the 192. 11 days. Go and connect the IoT in question to the Homerun and then look through the firewall logs for the port that was missed or not declared by the vendor. Oct 26, 2016 · Dumb question but you have rules in place to allow traffic between both subnets? I couldn't find too much information about the protocols used except for usage of UPnP by DLNA devices. x becomes a subnet within 2. NAS with DLNA is on VLAN 1. There is no reason to fix that - its not broken. Failing that, ask in the udpbroadcastrelay thread. X. All was working until I had to move the devices onto different subnets, then I ran into this. How to determine what is being blocked Jan 24, 2019 · Protect your network by segmenting your home network using pfsense firewall and have a dedicate machine for your critical data and online activities Configure pfSense for Chromecast Across Subnets/VLANs Chromecast devices are discoverable on the network via the mDNS protocol and that works well when all devices are on the same network. You could get some network segmentation by using a pfsense box with multiple lan interfaces and hooking one unmanaged switch to each interface. dlna would be fine if your on 1 flat network. Need some help. Just a question ---I enable mDNS traffic broadcast across subnets along with allowing client access to 224. You should have nothing behind pfsense doing routing, let pfsense Oct 5, 2020 · Hi, I have pfsense under vmware at home with 2 NICs : 192. Good luck! Sep 3, 2025 · On This Page Console VLAN configuration Web interface VLAN configuration VLAN Configuration This section covers how to configure VLANs in pfSense® software. My goal is to have DLNA across subnets . The relay is needed in order to allow speaker groups to be seen by iOS and Android devices as they require broadcasts to originate from an address on the same subnet. Feb 13, 2014 · However, Roadwarrior2 does not see the DLNA server (192. Feb 22, 2012 · Once the client has found the server pfSense will route traffic between the two subnets quite happily, as long as you have firewall rules to allow it. Nov 26, 2017 · On the pfSense you need rules which allow the access on the particular incoming interface, of course. There are many forum and blog posts out there that describe (or attempt to describe) how to make this work, however all of the ones I read suffered from one or both of these problems: Their instructions had errors (eg, reversing the upstream and downstream Jul 15, 2022 · Hi all, I am having trouble with getting DLNA to work from my NAS to my TV’s on separate VLAN’s. xxx. I have pfSense setup with 2 VLANs: 10 and 20, they are both on the LAN interface. ) are on different subnets. Developed and maintained by Netgate®. pfsense version 2. Jan 2, 2019 · I have been looking for a solution to have Sonos speakers and applications work across VLAN's using pfSense and, until now, haven't found a working solution. DLNA usually only works on NIC1 as well, so your other traffic would need to be on the second NIC. x used for infra and 10. On VLAN1 are a number of consumer devices, and on VLAN2 are a pair of OMV4 systems with mini-DLNA installed. According to this documentation from Roku's website, if I can route multicast packets addressed to 239. No visibility from my . Why are you using downstream routers?? Make NO sense to do so. 4_p2 Unifi 24 managed switch with VLANs and IGMP snooping enabled on the appropriate ports All internal VLANs go through the pfSense firewall (for what it is worth, DMZ and Internet are separate physical ports) VLAN 30 (green) for the 192. But if your wanting to segment your network up. Also docs for setup Dec 11, 2023 · Configure pfSense for Chromecast Across Subnets/VLANs Chromecast devices are discoverable on the network via the mDNS protocol and that works well when all devices are on the same network. I would take some traffic captures on both subnets and compare them with Wireshark. I searched some posts and read that IMGP proxy would do the trick, but I just don't get it to work. I have multiple VLANs with rules that segregate traffic between them su Proxy ARP is a method of bringing IPs into a subnet when they're not directly reachable. Any ideas? The kinsky site states i need to adjust the local firewall to allow the following: Firewall port settings The Windows installer automatically adds a rule for Kinsky to After realy huge effort trying to make multicast across subnets work, I seriously doubt if multicast is enable and/or working in pfSense. Jan 22, 2015 · I have set up pfSense with two NIC's as router for my home. certainly I'm doing something wrong or missing something. For normal TCP traffic I would create a single, precise fw rule allowing Jan 25, 2021 · Re: mDNS with vlans and Avahi I am having some of the same issues as the above topic. The pfSense® project is a powerful open source firewall and routing platform based on FreeBSD. Mar 19, 2019 · In addition the upnp daemon in pfSense, miniupnpd, supports IGD only. Jul 23, 2023 · Table of Contents Setup IPsec phase1 on the pfsense on Headquarter. Current set up is TV is on VLAN5/IOT LAN. You can literally give someone your IP address and port and be totally safe. 11. 1/24). I then put it into a separate VLAN and bridged it on the router to the IoT subnet, where my TV is connected to. Feb 3, 2019 · Nachdem das VLAN auf dem NAS deaktiviert und der DLNA-Server nicht erreichbar war, kam zwar ein Bild, aber die NFS-Freigaben waren futsch: ( Obwohl die IP-Cams es geschissen kriegen, ihre Vids per NFS in ein anderes Subnet zu schieben, Kodi schafft es irgendwie nicht. Many consumer devices like cameras and doorbells have apps that work by performing a broadcast to find the device, so the only way for the two to reach each other is to be on the same segment / vlan. Searching here in the forum revealed that with IGMP proxy I can accomplish this task. x), but the streaming quality is unbearable. mini-DLNA uses two ports: TCP 8200: I assume this is the direct media transfer port, and so we only need a rule on VLAN1 interface allowing TCP traffic to destination on VLAN2 subnet port 8200. Mar 3, 2020 · @ louis2 said in DLNA with multi VLAN: have those shares visible (in e. Dec 6, 2020 · DLNA Broadcast over multiple subnets Installing and Using OpenWrt Network and Wireless Configuration elsteiner13 December 6, 2020, 8:10pm Aug 28, 2025 · In a typical deployment of pfSense software hosts on the LAN are assigned an IP address, subnet mask and gateway within the LAN range of the firewall running pfSense software. I struggled to get DLNA working across pfSense and connect my TV to the server years ago. Have you tried enabling UPnP support in pfSense? Dec 26, 2022 · Hi Banister, First, I recommend you do some reading on multicast, IGMP, and PIM to understand how google devices (and others) magically work when everything is on one VLAN. 2. Jul 12, 2022 · Here's a little info to help you figure out for yourself what your situation is. 0/24 Interface: WLAN Type: Downstream Interface Network address: (WLAN IP Sep 2, 2025 · If the host that cannot be reached across the VPN does not have a default gateway, or has one pointing to something other than the firewall running OpenVPN, the host does not know how to properly get back to the remote network on the VPN. Setting up a UDP relay is out of the realm of my wheelhouse, but maybe someone else can chime in if even that's a proper solution or if there's a better way to handle multicast domain across subnets. 1) and HOME VLAN (192. On VLAN1 are a number of consumer devices, and on VLAN2 are a pair of NAS drives with mini-DLNA installed. You may restrict the access to the particular source and destination addresses (and ports). But I like to have Homekit have direct control. IGMP Hi Is there a way to make SDDP (DLNA discovery) work across different subnets? Thanks The pfSense® project is a powerful open source firewall and routing platform based on FreeBSD. 1/24 and 10. But as said since you only have one subnet that shouldn't be needed anyway. I’m sure there is many ways to Nov 3, 2017 · If i remove the pfsense and delete the static routes, my shield recognizes the server (because 4. Feb 3, 2020 · I have tested Chromecast, Apple Networking, Windows Network Discovery, Media Service Discovery, and some gaming apps across subnets and they appear to work nicely. 25. My plex server with DLNA server turned on is runing as plugin under Freen Jan 17, 2019 · The DLNA Media server is now running in a jail inside the Data Server, on the same VLAN as the TVs. Make a firewall rule allow all traffic between 192. I would argue that your wifi should actually be split between TRUSTED wifi devices - bridged to your wired VLAN, and UNTRUSTED or GUEST wifi devices - separate VLANs with separate access rules. Apr 22, 2017 · I have a small home network with PFSENSE as firewall/router, running very well (including SQUID). Homekit can't access the devices from main vlan. 11 ; VLAN 11; Interface IOT. A firewall isn't a switch. 1/24 My switch (tp-link TL-SG1016DE) has VLANs setup with both tagged on the pfSense port and Dec 2, 2023 · Background Chromecast & Nest Devices use Multicast Domain Name Services (mDNS) to perform device discovery. g. Packets with a TTL lower than the value in this field will be ignored. but I can see PIMD on pfsense is relatively new, so maybe not surprising. There is no restriction from main to IoT vlan. Configure pfSense for Chromecast Across Subnets/VLANs Chromecast devices are discoverable on the network via the mDNS protocol and that works well when all devices are on the same network. I have the problem that I want to integrate apple services on my unraid server and most of the network communication doesnt work across subents. I thought this should be straightforward but it doesn't work! Jan 1, 2021 · Ok guys I under stand PIMD is an addition to avahi, and is designed to route igmp network packets. Cheers. The two subnets feed into a pfsense router. If all your vlans are on the same device, IGMP is needed to support multicast communication between them as it can track the May 17, 2022 · The Laptop can ping all devices on IoT VLAN, the pfsense addresses on both LAN (192. We are going to start he pfsense IPsec configuration with phase1 and in phase2 we will start adding the multiple subnets. 250:1900 UDP for network discovery. Then adjust your rules with the additional port and disable the allow all and test. I recently learned doing the VLAN config right, but now have another problem. I can already use casting with other systems (Printers, TV’s, etc. It does not support DLNA so won't help at all with media streaming applications. Since I would never get this to work I decided to make it simples, have everything under the same subnet. The problem is the discovery process: Aug 7, 2023 · What server are you trying to connect too. Right now I am using a pass any any firewall rule for the quest so it should be able to connect to anything it needs to. It's also a requirement that pfSense is the default gateway on both machines. Dec 6, 2023 · You’ve probably heard all about creating multiple VLANs, for things like your IoT network, guest wifi, and more. xxx and 10. Nov 30, 2018 · Hi guys, Based on the following setup I'm trying to get DLNA across VLAN subnets with IGMP Proxy working but without success: VLAN A = Wifi network > 192. Come along on this adventure! Contents Video Jul 9, 2011 · Hi, I just got an wireless adapter for my TV and oh crap, DLNA doesn't seem to work between subnets. On the WAN side is also one device that need to access the DLNA server. There is a thread on the Ubiquiti subreddit that says you need to broadcast mDNS across subnets and that should do it. I've read about how DNS and WINS gets confused when accessing smb shares across VLANS/subnets, and have found a lot of material, but couldn't find a solution that works. rtwun dg kddz tb edpzr ig1u3dj 2noc k5w 8b aeb
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